I myself have wondered about the small size of clothing from earlier eras. I want a nitro piston to avoid any spring troubles. Shoot along the edge of a river. I’m converting my Talon SS from CO2 to air. Oh oh, time for me to go quiet. please take a moment & say a prayer for Tom. Here’s a comment I copied over from the Benjamin Trail Nitro article. Especially if they move from 177/22 to .50 pellet guns Or maybe Jamie will use his air cannon! I’m told a .22 is a great choice for accuracy and knock-down and has a wider range of grains.So with that said.This is what I’ve found. For example, a Gamo 1250 will shoot over 1,200 f.p.s. So I have observed a Kodiak .22 cal pellet travel between 420 and 430 yards. Get in a boat with the gun and use a range finder to measure the distance from shore. For maximum efficiency, the scope increases accuracy with a 4x magnification. To test my theory, I went back to Chairgun and looked at the “Angle for Max Range” on a variety of pellets. Well, I’ll also violate BB’s challenge and speculate rather than offer facts. This article is reprinted in the “Cartridges of the World ” by Frank Barnes ,forth edition that I have. I entered my Bronco in the Airgunarena.com eMail bench rest comp. Two zero points If you look at the pellet's curving trajectory and the scope's straight line of sight, you soon realize that, if the scope is adjusted correctly, it will cross the pellet's path at a near point. The RWS Hobbys are definitely the pellet for my Bronco. He’s still getting antibiotics and has been busy doing blogs for this week. He said to thank you profusely for the info. Both he & you Edith are in my thoughts & prayers, & I wish him a full & speedy recovery. Match Director, 07-06-2015, 01:03 AM #3. Not that the tweaks didn’t help, but I’m certainly not getting sub 1/2″ 10-shot groups at 20 yards yet, like I was hoping for. They seemed to like their armor light. So I can’t really say what everyone else’s can or can’t do. The main reason for this is that firstly, they have more mass than the Wadcutter and secondly, they’re more aerodynamic. In case you’re wondering, here’s a short list of what I did to the gun: Cleaned factory oil out, deburred and polished all the powerplant essentials, installed JM piston and breech seals, lubed with moly, reworked the trigger assy and installed a GRT-III, fabricated aluminum receiver spacers/shims (receiver bolt was bottoming out with nylon shims and barrel was overly loose), machined the detent lock pin (lock-up was horribly inadequate), lapped/polished inleade, re-crowned barrel, polished transfer port, etc, etc, etc. Join Date Dec 2013 Location Wigan Posts 3,776 . The spotters would need some kind of shielding for protection. That doesn’t seem intuitive. So, I thought I would perform some investigation myself. All that makes sense, but I wonder if there’s more? Are you looking at max kill distance? On average a .177 air rifle has a range of about 400 yards (366 meters) but for some models, this distance can be further. All objects fall at the same speed, so if anyone can find a chart on how far objects fall for every tenth of the first second, then that will give you an approximation. But I figure for the same price the same caliber, the same piston, how different could they be? I want the quietest and strongest for the price.HA! I missed them both! What a sweet gun it is. The type you choose depends on what you are intending to do with your rifle. If you’re not sure what this is or indeed what the answer is, just check out this article, as it is quite important if you’re using this power plant.eval(ez_write_tag([[250,250],'airgunhouse_com-leader-2','ezslot_18',116,'0','0'])); If you’re not sure what types of airgun are available to you, then take a look here. The Benj.Trail NP/XL 1100 or the Falcon Hunter. You’d be out with a metal detector for the next two years trying to find it. Barnes and R.A Helson cites a forensic case where a male child was killed by a pellet (Sheridan’s bantam) fired from the Sheridan blue streak air rifle at the range of five feet. While a perfect brain shot could take down these animals, most people aren’t shooting that good and the guns they’re using aren’t that accurate (because the 600 fps guns are often BB guns). Runner-up for the best Gamo Air Rifle. But Tom and many others have contradicted this and said that this basic rule of projectile trajectory is not true for diabolo pellets because of their light mass in relation to air resistance, their flight characteristics or whatever. Ronnie and I had a great time, and I feel the targets are getting closer to being ready for the big match at the end of the month. Flight 2.23s. On a colder day, a pellet may lose velocity more quickly as cold air is denser than warm air. For maximum distance, the trajectory would be at 45 degrees to the horizontal.eval(ez_write_tag([[300,250],'airgunhouse_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_7',114,'0','0'])); We’re getting a bit silly now of course, as this is not how an Air Rifle would ever be used but we’re talking about achieving maximum distance, not actually hitting something. The other lesson I learned is not to buy a TX200 for your first springer if you want to learn proper hold discipline. I found, that the ball would go about 450 yards at max, before hitting the ground when fired at a 30 degree angle, with the gun held at shoulder ht. We found that the pellet guns we shot, which were Crosman Benjamin pumpers, and one Comenta break barrel in .22, would only go about 200 yards before hitting the ground. This is first time I’ve posted here, but have followed the blog a long time, so just wanted to start by saying it’s good to hear you’re doing better, Tom. You’ll have to look there June 1 to see my score. Namely, the barrel is shrouded with an aluminum tube and the muzzle cap screws on to keep it in place. .177 caliber pellets. Bad news for the back yard shooters. So generally, a pellet will travel further on a warmer day than it would on a cold day. Drive to my parents house (they have 20 acres and a big barn, whereas I live in the city) on a hopefully windless day with my spotter, my gun, lots of ammo, and a pair of two-way radios. I would hope, at this point, that most everything would stay on the paper for easier identification. So, I wonder if a pellet shot a 30 degrees has enough foot lbs. Count me in:) I could use some advice. Typically, these are the only obvious factors that will impact the accuracy of your shot – for instance, you won’t find that humidity will impact it to any degree. They tested this combination and concluded that a pellet had to be traveling at about 370-400FPS to inflict damage enough to be lethal at close range. This doesn’t actually happen as much as you might think as pellets are designed to stay on target in such conditions. (I cant/hate to shoot without)I imagine I could put on aftermarket sights,I havent checked ,but if it’s not available, my local gunsmith will hook me up.I’m just not into scopes.The trail np/xl does have a .22 model with a wood stock and quiet rating of 2-3 at apx. Thanks for drawing my attention back to his question. They were significantly larger before. Re: Dangerous distance. I have the Trail NP version not the XL. Seems kind of far for pellet travel to me...but I am no genius. I could sit all day long marking targets or where pellets drop. Adjust the gun down, one degree at a time, to find what angle caused me to (again) fall short of the barn. We’re really talking about trying to figure distance +/- 5 to 10%. Just giving an observation based on my own experience. As domed pellets are usually heavy, they aren’t as fast as other types, but they are more accurate over a long-range. So, even to deflect or soften the blow, the armor had to be thicker or more complex. Sure enough, the the higher the pellet’s BC (the lower the air resistance), the higher the required angle. This is hypothetical though of course and all we’re doing is trying to explore the maximum range. We would shoot pellet guns, and our bows & arrows. Walk your dog in a straight line and he will find it. describes disproved calculations that seemed rock solid. I might make trajectory maps for several different angles of elevation and see how well each map matched actual trajectory at fairly close range. Given that situation, the .177 will leave the barrel moving several fps faster than the .22 but the .22 will deliver more energy to a target 25 yards away. Of course, I haven’t mentioned stuff like Tornado’s and Hurricane’s here! on the water), then take the angle to the projectile. One thing that sets pointed pellets apart from wadcutters and domed pellets is the skirt, which tends to be longer to compensate for the lighter tip. It’s a dark matter and I don’t feel myself quite competent for further discussion. +1 to the idea of still water, splash+ Welcome to the Airgunhouse where I like to nerd out a little about my passion for all stuff related to airguns. Where are you? You need to angle the shot to accommodate the flight time before hitting your target. http://www.physicsclassroom.com/mmedia/vectors/mr.cfm. This one did not have the pellet seater but was not drilled for the seater to be attached so it looks like it didn’t come with a pellet seater to begin with. PJN, And armor weight – yes, I know, but you forget the other side If our ancestors were stronger than we are, they could pack relatively more punch into their hand-held weapons, and weapons would be bigger and heavier. See how much velocity is retained at point of impact . I too thought that a 45 degree elevation would yield the longest distance downrange. They shot in Hunter class, but only had time for about half the course, both were hitting about half their shots while they figured out the hold over. Most people prefer a speed of 600 to 900 feet per second because they get more accuracy. It would be interesting to see the optimal angle of elevation. You should never aim an air rifle towards another property or land that does not belong to you (unless you have specific permission.). -AlanL. Some more evidence on this side of the case is as follows. You could also replace the graphite pellet lubricant with ground up cat food, shoot a few pellets, then wait for dusk. At any rate, you do not see baseball bats getting heavier even if the players are pumping themselves up with illegal steroids. It’s not only important but it also supports what Robert Beeman had stated for years in his catalogs. This is something my son asked me recently and I discovered I actually had no idea whatsoever what the answer was. Do a little angle math, and you have your distance. However, its useful to remember, that when fired horizontal the maximum range will be vastly reduced because the bullet drop will be so great on a non FAC air rifle that the bullet will hit the ground. Sustained hand-to-hand combat is such a different world that I’m not certain about speculating about it from common sense. to break skin when it falls to earth. For example: A 177 Kodiak/Barracuda 10.6gn Pellet fired at 900 ft/s is dangerous out to the following distances. If my old man caught me shooting at his barn to determine max range, I would be in some trouble if I did any damage or not. Matt61… the ballistic calculator uses the ballistic coefficient (air drag) of the pellet. It is a “fair” estimate for “lethal” distances, but not a max range. We have tested this once in Holland. Get a very large sheet of paper (like 30×30′) and see at what distance the bottom of the paper can just be hit. What is the reason that airguns tend to like or dislike certain pellets? Best thing is, know what you are shooting at and what is around in case of a miss. Interesting. Ronnie made one and missed one. Apparently, the army experiment that B.B. I calculated these for a 0 degree incline for a worst case number. DaveUK, I’m baaaaack! I called Tom and told him what you reported. Supposedly there is also an old Canadian stamp with his portrait, I’ll have to check collectors for that I guess. This was to determine the maximuim range such a combination would launch the 50 gr RB to establish a baseline as to dangerous range when fired up into trees and the target (squirrel ) was missed, where no solid backstop existed. Since the speed of sound is around 1,100 FPS this air gun has achieved supersonic velocity and therefore belongs in the magnum class of air rifles. Perhaps for romantic reasons I like to think of enormously strong and capable forebears like Conan the Barbarian. 10. The hard part is calculating the effect of air resistance. Also, I have no idea how you’d actually find the pellet if you fired the Air Rifle in this manner! Benjamin Trail Nitro Piston. Measuring error should not be more than a 10-15 meters. Today’s guns show pretty much the same thing despite vastly improved pellets and power. It was noted that this was speculative, as factors such as clothing and pellet wt and shape would contribute to lethality at what ever range the pellet struck the target. Instead, use a Beeman Kodiak/H&N Barracuda (same pellet) that weighs 10.6 grains or a Crosman Premier 10.5-grain pellet. p.s. You could start at 100 yards and fire into the pool (not a difficult task) then move back another 50 yards and shoot at the pool and keep moving back 50 yards or less at a time until the pellet starts falling short of the pool. Fire at varying distances until I could hit the barn (this would likely be determined by sound, as relayed by the spotter, since a pellet would probably not even dimple the wood at that distance). Ashland Air Rifle Range, BB and Edith: You?re shooting at roughly 31.1 FPE which is not that bad at all. As for weapons, I’ll extrapolate from baseball. Regarding my comment yesterday on the PPK vs. popcan: My own PPK is the only example I have ever shot. Draw a large X on the paper at the same height as my gun would be firing from. Are you considering ricochets if hunting and missing? During the range test, a chronograph measured pellet velocity in feet per second (FPS) at the muzzle. Spotters would be needed. PP Calc was born from the need of all good Spring-Piston shooters to face the inevitable variations that the trajectory of their projectiles suffer when changing venues. Since a pellet is drag stabilized, it would never “tumble.” The bottom line is that I seriously doubt that the BC is good for all velocities. Please chime in and give us the equation for the distance that it will travel. We fired five-shot groups at targets 25 yards away. Obviously, as Vince said, other factors come into play as well. However, the longer the distance you’re shooting, the more it will impact the accuracy. We knew the range ,because we knew how long the fields were. Maybe this should be discussed on today’s blog, Springfield Armory M1A Underlever Pellet Rifle, Powered by WordPress. There are several types of pellets for a .177 air rifle on the market. Using the book “Firearms, the Law, and Forensic Ballistics” (ISBN:0748404325), Chapter 7, “Terminal/Wound Ballistics and Distance of Firing” you get data on a handful of common pellets and their threshold velocities for breaking the skin. Also it includes the less powerful not really suited for hunting type guns. Because they’re fundamentally lighter than most other pellets, they travel faster. So, we stayed on that lane and shot the 3/8″ kill zones again. I just posted a response. Like I have said anyone who has been using the blog by now should understand who is posting, I’m sure there are bigger problems to be addressed (like getting Tom well). Now I want to renew my prowess as a hunter and be able to pass it down to my kids at the same time. Don’t forget each pellet shape has a different ballistic coefficient; giving it a a more accurate flight. Rather, it derives the BC from basic, approximate data. Some words considering greatswords. So I guess even that Civil War data shows that our ancestors were no stronger than us, just a bit more used to heavy physical work and with better stamina When I was a student, I used to make “easy money” working as a loader. Bullets fired from guns with longer barrels and more powder travel faster. However, if you’d just like a summary then carry on reading the below – here is some information to help you select from one of six types of pellet:eval(ez_write_tag([[300,250],'airgunhouse_com-box-4','ezslot_9',110,'0','0'])); These are the ideal pellet for target shooting in your back garden. There are some .177 air rifles that will shoot pellets at over 1200 feet per second (f.p.s). This is definitely not a toy and must be handled with extreme care. Give us a simple test we can really use to answer this question. I did not realize that if you did login you could not change this. Coupled with the maximum velocity, the increased magnification makes it a suitable air rifle for pest control. Maybe mine just shoots straighter than most. I still have my Sheridan Blue Streak from the 70’s and at 8 pumps it still knocks them down hard. 300 yards?? I’m guessing that a pellet doesn’t “fly” with the same aerodynamic profile when it leaves the muzzle as when it hits the ground at maximum distance. Gamo 3-9x40 scope included. It’s 35 years old and is only used for storage of non-valuables these days. (b) Child 1-38 months: Spire point, 8.6gn, 272fps +-36fps ~ 1.41ft/lbs +-0.5, Now you have the dangerous kinetic energy threshold for a spire point pellet you can push those numbers through a ballistics calculator. Obviously we don’t have a blimp hanger, but a wide-open, flat area should work. Answer. View Latest Price → Read Customer Reviews: Best Budget Option. For simplicity, that equation is : (Pellet weight x velocity^2)/450240=X ft/lbs . But you have probably figured that out already. Enlist the help of a friend to act as a spotter. (All such measurements should deduct your height over level ground). Air rifles are more correctly measured by Muzzle Energy, rather than by Muzzle Velocity. The truth is…nobody knows. You would not use them in a 1250 because they are too light. Well just finished watching “The Hunted” with Tommy Lee Jones, excellent movie even though I’ve seen it many times. This would be a guide for the spotter, not something I would be aiming at from 400+ yards away. Update on Tom/B.B. For now, though, happy shooting, stay safe and have fun. You will, however, find a pellet is slowed down in windy conditions and so won’t travel as far as on a still day. I do think the main idea with an “action pistol” is not accuracy, but feel and fun. The GAMO Varmint Air Rifle shoots a .177 PBA Platinum alloy pellet at 1250 fps, making it an ideal pellet gun for hunting small game, pest control and target practice. (b) Child 1-38 months: 280 yards +/- 50 yards. Second were made for purely ceremonial purposes, to signify power and importance of an accompanied person (just an expansion of a protection function of zweihander) and could be well over 180 and even 250 cm in length, heavily decorated and just heavy. On distance again, I have also fired .310 dia RB from a TC Cherokee .32 cal muzzle loader at a muzzle velocity of around 800 FPS. I think this could also be easily replicated with a swimming pool if anyone has one that also has 400-500 yards of open space adjacent. Guess it’s a good chance to test my way of max range estimation. At this distance, the pellet will have very little stopping power and would probably just bounce off the lonely tin-can sitting those 400 yards away! Ronnie made them both! Prove something? This is what I learned in my high school physics class, oh so many years ago. The only way of doing that is to bring the barrel down closer to level. I’m most intrigued by the fact that modern airguns of greater power do not shoot any further than earlier lower-powered models. Well, it might be. Nope. But then I cleaned the next four lanes and Ronnie missed two in those same lanes, so we were tied. As for range measurement, consider an industrial handheld laser rangefinder. Thus, the faster the bullet the further it travels. It produces around 20 FPE at the muzzle. 7b. I guess air rifle, set @ 45 degrees to the horizon would make a longest shot and the way of measuring it would be quite precise, but one must notice that humid air is less dense than dry, so pellet speed will decrease a little less. The Department of Environmental Conservation for Binghamton, New York, has officially sanctioned the hunting of some quarry with airguns. My Mom maiden name is LaValley. His belly is as flat as a pancake. Not me – I think that question was directed toward TwoTalon. It has taken many years and a lot of relatives combining family trees, but all records have been confirmed from what I’ve been told. The relative quite crack of an airgun in the distance followed by the Zzzzzzzip as it goes by.marvelous. One hit my bare hand and it was like a hailstone, no biggie. I like Orin’s idea with side of the barn and freezer paper. : Tom is improving quite nicely. 3. Asked by Wiki User. Douglas M.”. Another .177 Belgium Hyscore. The weather could not have been better. Edith “A flat belly” Now I am starting to get jealous.I can’t seem to shift mine:), Sorry I can’t help with the distance shot experiment what with being short of distance where I live.lol The local shops that fill CO2 are no good and one even damaged my 12oz bottle valve. There is a result of course but with so many variables involved, there’s quite a large range of uncertainty. That way, if you miss your target the ground acts as a backstop.eval(ez_write_tag([[580,400],'airgunhouse_com-medrectangle-3','ezslot_0',108,'0','0'])); Alternatively, set up a large concrete slab as a backstop. Today it makes me sick to think that I used to haul more than a ton in 20 runs. Can I concour what you said about the design of an airgun pellet having limiting factors? When the velocity reaches 1200 f.p.s it breaks the sound barrier and produces a loud cracking sound. I do love a bit of a debate though so if your opinions differ in any way to anything I’ve written here, drop me a comment and let’s discuss! That is … The range was 10 yards for each shot. I wanted to try my more powerful steroid 392 and see how far the pellet goes but there isn’t a scope on it and my eyes are not good enough to see the pellet splash down without the aid of a scope. Again, I’m not an expert in the field, if you know Russian, you can find more facts on this “master”, but as far as I know he learned from Sergey Medennikov and Mikhail Ryabko, who in turn both learned from Alexey Kadochnikov, the inventor of that “leverage” style of offence and self-defence and still trains it to real SOU. Or 0.0000003 times the distance between the Earth and the Moon. That’s the simplest way I can think…. If I point my airgun up at a 30 degree angle and shoot across the lake, I can see the pellet splash down near the opposide shore through my scope on a calm and glassy day. There is even a suburb of Montreal named after him, about 2 hours from where my parents live. Then we came to the 3/8″ KZs and we each missed one and made one. I got lucky and dropped them both this time. (can I?) We had problems with a couple targets, but we fixed them as we shot the course. Range find and you have your distance. I have a post dedicated to the types of pellets you can use actually so if you’re interested in finding more information about this then take a look. Very light wind, partly cloudy, and 65 to 70 degrees. The best was the subsonic 44s coming up the range though. First were made for doppelsoldners to cut through enemy pikes and protect important persons, sized no more than 170 cm, maximum reasonable length for a 180+ cm man to operate, reasonably light and sharp. What a great day of shooting. I have no way of knowing. It loves Hobbys. I’m anxious to see how it’ll do in the eMatches after I go full compressed air. I was using RWS Superdome Hobby’s from my TX200. Now the big bore airrifles like a .50 will have a much more powerful powerplant than you will see on a .177 gun. Regarding armor, I understand that squires training to be medieval knights would practice running in their armor and doing somersaults and cartwheels. 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Tolerances no doubt play a large group of coons, possums and skunks, you know about 6.9 and!, Crosman Premire 10.5gr ” is not a problem that needs any immediate attention with so years! Pellets have a broad, round head which cuts big holes in targets! 7.9Gr to see how it ’ s not only important but it also what...